Question for you:
Who here prefers the phrase ‘fucking him raw’ to be metaphorical as opposed to being literal?
Cos I gotta tell you that when I recently read it in both a yaoi manga and an m/m romance… well, it had my orifice clenching… and not in a good way.
Kris + Books = Good. *Sometimes*. 
I hear you on that… and the rough stuff “hurts so good” not really for me.
Whether the story actually uses that sentence or not I think of it if the guys don't use lube. Ouch. I prefer the metaphorical usage of the sentence, thank you.
I've been known to make “Ouch, ouch, ouch, no!” editorial comments on books that include anal sex scenes and have no mention of the use of lubrication in the scene. I'd rather think of it metaphorically. Not that I'm one of the people who thinks the description “puckered rosebud” should be used, but I usually prefer for the hero who's topping right then to be relatively gentle with his partner.
Huh. I just read a book with no use of lube. I was like “Wahhh?”. Okay, maybe the condom was lubed in the first instance, that helps but the second time it was bareback and granted they'd fucked like bunnies the night before so he was probably stretched nicely but no lube. They were in Italy for cripes sake, not the deepest darkest Africa. I'm sure they have lube in Italy.
However when I hear “fuck him raw” my mind hops into porn mode which = bareback.
Tam: I just read that book too and thought – where's the lube? – as they began :).
I've also just read a BDSM book where the whole idea was to inflict pain on entry – the bottom guy got off on it – THAT made me clench, I can tell you, and not in a good way. I spent quite a lot of the first part of the book wincing and sucking in breath through my teeth.
Conversely, I read a yaoi book the other day that had condoms and lube – I was shocked!
Now I have the word “chafing” in my head.
Usually when that area gets raw, there is blood involved. Anal tears = not sexy.
I love that phrase. But then…its me and yeah.
~smooches~
Miranda: I can give or take it depending on the context of the story, but in these instances fucking someone until they actually hurt? No. Just no.
Tracy: In the romance lube was definitely involved, but still… Eeek.
Emilie: LOL. Have you really, Emilie? I can just imagine the reaction to those comments. *grin*
How one of the character's tops really does depend on the scene and the other character for me. At the same time, I don't think an author really wants their readers to be wincing during sex scenes instead of squirming because they think it's sexy. I hope not anyway.
Tam: “They were in Italy for cripes sake, not the deepest darkest Africa. I'm sure they have lube in Italy.”
*snort* Maybe they didn't have any olive oil handy? Or maybe they drank it because that is all they had to keep hydrated from fucking like bunnies all night?
Jenre: “I've also just read a BDSM book where the whole idea was to inflict pain on entry – the bottom guy got off on it – THAT made me clench, I can tell you, and not in a good way. I spent quite a lot of the first part of the book wincing and sucking in breath through my teeth.”
The book I read had the bottom getting off on the pain too. I also spent my time wincing, especially when the bottom was still hurting the next day but they again had rough sex. That's just asking for a trip to the doctor or hospital. Not sexy at all.
Katiebabs chook: It's an appropriate word to have in this context. Ouchie.
Jen: Yeah. Squicky.
Jase, hun, what are we going to do with you. 🙂
I guess the point I am trying to half-arsedly make is that there is a difference between 'hurts so good' and 'hurts so good that I think it's time for a trip to the ER'.
Oh OUCH!!
I don't recall coming across that phrase in any of the books I've read so far, but if I did it would be a cringe moment.
Definitely metaphorical. Otherwise ouch. Same with the “fuck you so hard you'll feel it the next day” which I've come across a lot. Ouchie, ouchie.
Tam and Jen, maybe the guy in that book had one of those super special self-lubricating anuses. 😛
*wincing*
MsM: Sometimes the phrase really works because it reflects the intensity of the moment. Other times, though… not so much.
Richelle: “Same with the “fuck you so hard you'll feel it the next day” which I've come across a lot.”
Yeah, that is a phrase you read a lot in m/m. Always makes me want to know who wouldn't feel it the next day.
Chris: I know.
Having literally been, let me tell you it's not NEARLY as much fun as it sounds. Esp when those raw places turn into yeast infection breeding grounds… Feeling it the next day isn't much fun either.
In m/m I tend to read “raw” as “without condoms.” Now and then, I have a character want it without lube, but I always make it clear that this act hurts and pain is the point of it.
lol…only you. I've read it in m/f too and it just made my girl parts hurt. Ew!
PS. Nice picture. Gave me a giggle. Thank you for that. 😀
Angelia: Blech. Poor you. 😦
“In m/m I tend to read “raw” as “without condoms.””
You know it never even occurred to me to equate 'raw' to 'bareback' until you and Tam mentioned it, Angelia. Apparently I am still an innocent. Who knew.
Bridget: I've read it in m/m too and have had the same reaction. *crosses legs*
And, welcome! 🙂
Bridget: I meant m/F. I think I might need more coffee.
“You know it never even occurred to me to equate 'raw' to 'bareback'”
Are – you – kidding? Girl, you so need a proper pron education! If you see “raw” in a title, it means bareback!
As for the orifice clenching – some guys have so much pre-cum they are able to use it as a natural lube; however, usually it doesn't last long enough. I vote for lube. Much more fun with it. 😉
Matthew: AH HA! So, you're a bottom. I knew you would give it away sooner or later. ;P
*chuckles* Do you really think the top has that much fun without the lube? The skin on penis is quite delicate, you know.
Sorry, still not giving away. 🙂
Dammit! *poutmope*
Definitely metaphorical. As the man said in Evolution “there always time for lubricant”.
@ nichem “Tam and Jen, maybe the guy in that book had one of those super special self-lubricating anuses”
– I used to work for a chip company (who shall remain nameless) and they were trialling some special chip where the body didn't absorb all the fat. They gave up on it – the problem? anal leakage. So, um, yeah, that's what I had in my mind when you mentioned “self-lubricating anuses” and that's soooo not sexy!!
@ Kris – “Apparently I am still an innocent”
**snorts coffee over keyboard** 🙂
Kaetrin: I'm pretty sure that I haven't given you permission to be rude to me. Hmpf!
@ Kris *snort*
I'll see your hmpf and raise you a flounce!
Completely metaphorical. Because I found this scary forum filled with emergency medicine doctors explaining all the things they see…
Conversely, I read a yaoi book the other day that had condoms and lube – I was shocked!
*faints*
Kaetrin: Someone sooo needs to be sent back to minion school.
Orannia: Please do NOT feel compelled to send me that link. Ever.
Fact: The skin on a peen and the anal cavity are very sensitive. Lubricants are a necessity and can be fun M/M authors!
When I read that phrase or hear in RL, I think “bareback”.
Myth: The self-lubricated arse is a MYTH. Unless the uke is an alien-lad from Uranus *snortchuckle”, DOES NOT EXIST! M/M authors unless sci-fi with said alien-lad character as a uke, stop using it. And for gosh sakes, my RL fellow gays who are ukes, you dont have a self-lubricating arse implicating that your booty is the bomb..It is basic Biology 101 my fellow gays..
Disclaimer: This comment by no means implicate or identify said commenter (Ozakie T. Knotts) as a seme or uke. He will follow the by-laws, statutes, and amends of the M/M Constitution of the M/M Universe and plead the 5th amendment likek Matthew. LOL
Veri-word: troth: Ex. Ozakie speaks the troth of said matters of fucking raw, lubricants and self-lubricating arses.
When I see “raw,” I think “ouch!” It's that same OMG, Ouch!” that I think when authors use shampoo or soap as lube. Soap dries things out, That's got to be irritating if not downright painful.
Ozakie: “This comment by no means implicate or identify said commenter (Ozakie T. Knotts) as a seme or uke. He will follow the by-laws, statutes, and amends of the M/M Constitution of the M/M Universe and plead the 5th amendment likek Matthew. LOL”
You're so mean to me, Ozakie… I know! You could whisper it here and I promise to the Book Goddesses that I won't tell anyone else. I swear on my copy of Perry Moore's Hero.
Eyre: “That's got to be irritating if not downright painful.”
Word. The yaoi I read the seme rimmed the uke's 'raw' arse to 'soothe' it before again fucking him. Umm, no. That isn't going to help at all, dumb *literally* arse.
Um, sorry to be behind the times but what is a “uke” and a “seme”? I is confused.
Kaetrin: LOL. They are yaoi terms. Seme is the top/the seducer/the giver and the uke is the bottom/the seducee (i'm sure that's a word)/the receiver.
Please do NOT feel compelled to send me that link. Ever.
So I should send it now then? *grin*
*sociopathicrainbowtroutstareofdeath*